NRL naughty boys

[F111]

The NRL is about to take a big hit. 4Corners tomorrow night.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/s ... 09,00.html

CHANNEL 9 Footy Show star and former league ace Matthew Johns last night told of his shame over his involvement in alleged group sex during his playing days.

It is alleged Johns was involved in group sex with a 19-year-old woman in a Christchurch hotel after playing for Cronulla in a trial against the NZ Warriors in 2002.

The woman, who has declined to be named, claimed she suffered psychological and emotional problems following the incident.

"Every time I looked up there were more and more people in the room. There were lots of guys watching," she told the ABC.

"Maybe two or three were on the bed that were doing stuff to me." Four NZ police travelled to Sydney in 2002 to interview Johns with Sharks teammates - also allegedly involved - but no charges were laid.

Johns, who admitted participating in the incident but claimed it was consensual, told his wife Trish after returning to Australia.

"It happened seven years ago, it caused great pain to my wife and family," Johns told The Daily Telegraph yesterday.

"It took us a long time to get over it. It pains me they have to go through it again."

The incident will be part of a Four Corners show on ABC TV on Monday which focuses on the misbehaviour of NRL players.

Johns also addressed the allegations at the beginning of last night's Footy Show.

"For me personally, it put my family through enormous anguish and embarrassment and for that I can't say sorry enough.

"Police investigated the situation, the allegations and there were no charges laid.

"This has been a cause of major embarrassment for a lot of people."

Johns was the face of the NRL's 2009 membership drive campaign but the television and print media advertisements already have concluded.

The NRL acted swiftly earlier this season when Manly star Brett Stewart was accused of a sexual assault.

Stewart, who denies the charges, was suspended for four games and withdrawn as the face of the NRL's main $1.5 million TV advertising campaign.

NRL chief executive David Gallop claimed he was not in a position last night to comment on the issue. Johns is also assistant coach with NRL club Melbourne Storm, who have reached the past three Grand Finals.

"Matthew's role will continue with Melbourne," Storm CEO Brain Waldron said.

[j-mac31]

The NRL is about to take a big hit.

Are they? NRL player getting in trouble is like baseballers testing positive for drugs - seems to happen every month, we're all over it now.

[F111]

The NRL is about to take a big hit.

Are they? NRL player getting in trouble is like baseballers testing positive for drugs - seems to happen every month, we're all over it now.

It's a shame the public might be getting accustomed to this ...

Considering the identity involved and the 4Corners involvement, it might just escalate a little I expect.
Johns already has an apology video on the 'net.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/s ... 21,00.html

I expect this may be quite amusing and interesting to many young blokes. Would I be wrong

[Crazyman]

The NRL is about to take a big hit.

Are they? NRL player getting in trouble is like baseballers testing positive for drugs - seems to happen every month, we're all over it now.

It's a shame the public might be getting accustomed to this ...

Considering the identity involved and the 4Corners involvement, it might just escalate a little I expect.
Johns already has an apology video on the 'net.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/s ... 21,00.html

I expect this may be quite amusing and interesting to many young blokes. Would I be wrong

I hope that you are wrong F111...it is appalling behaviour and I hope that no-one in their right mind thinks any of this is amusing...

[Sismis]

One aspect i find disturbing is how much of a trial by media this is. I'm not sure we will ever know the real facts of what went on but by the sounds of it there was a fair bit of regret all round. The police investigated it and no charges were laid, yet the media is able to drag a guys name though the mud giving him no real way to defend himself. Four Corners could easily have edited it so Johns' name was not specifically mentioned yet they went the other way and allowed an anonymous person to sling mud. Does not seem to me to be respsonsible journalism and is more what i would expect from today-tonight rather than Four Corners.

[Crazyman]

One aspect i find disturbing is how much of a trial by media this is. I'm not sure we will ever know the real facts of what went on but by the sounds of it there was a fair bit of regret all round. The police investigated it and no charges were laid, yet the media is able to drag a guys name though the mud giving him no real way to defend himself. Four Corners could easily have edited it so Johns' name was not specifically mentioned yet they went the other way and allowed an anonymous person to sling mud. Does not seem to me to be respsonsible journalism and is more what i would expect from today-tonight rather than Four Corners.

Too trus Sismis. Add to that the fact that it was an incident from about 6 years ago (unlike some of the other incidents that have occurred that came out within a few days...) and no charges were actually laid or any action taken...

[Scott]

I emailed a work collegue from Sydney telling him this is getting out of hand and thats it's even big new down here. This is his response.

"This has got me fired up mate….. what a joke. He did NOTHING wrong. The NRL are treading on very dangerous ground here…. Here’s a few reasons why;

1. His brother admitted to drug taking throughout his career, yet his brother is contracted to channel 9 and works with NRL clubs and they want to stamp Matthew Johns out.
2. There are other players that have been involved with group sex or sexual “misconduct”, and it’s public knowledge….. Paul Gallon – current Aust player + Sharks captain, Jonathon Thurston – current Aust player + Cowboys captain, Anthony Laffranchi – current Aust player + Titans player, Roy Asotasi – current NZ player + Souths captain, Brett Stewart – played for Aust + Manly and is the poster boy for NRL, Renny Matua – current Sharks player, Dane Tilse – current Canberra player….. is the NRL going to sack these guys now (and these are just the ones I could think of on the top of my head – I’m sure there’s plenty more)???
3. This is all just a knee-jerk reaction – the NRL knew about this 7 years ago when it happened, but they wait until now to act???
4. The chick agreed to it… she just wants her 15 minutes (and plenty of $$$$’s). This portion I've edited for obvious reasons

Matty Johns is just the scapegoat the NRL is hanging out to dry to make it look like they care!!!!"

As you can tell there are some supporters for Johns.

[The Man from Bomberland]

Johns should be sacked this afternoon and I think he will be. 9 can't afford to keep a personality who makes women switch to another network.

But more importantly he's not sorry and only apoligisied to his family. The team treated her like a piece of meat. Anybody who watched the footage on Monday night could hear the despair in that woman's voice.

One important point is that I don't think this issue is just confined to rugby league. There are many men in society who view women in the same light. Johns is taking a massive hit but his media profile is enormous and he is beemed into television loungerooms 2-3 times a week. The network and NRL simply can't have him on their books anymore. He's poisen.

I find your friend's comments sickening. It's unfortunate he's not the only nimrod in rugby leagye who holds that view.

[Sismis]

TMFB, My issue is that we only get one side of the story. I am not willing to aportion blame to either side because based on one interview we simply do not have enough facts.

From a position of anonimity with an obvious bias she is able to say whatever she wants. Has what she said even been verfied with what the police investigated? It is simply not right to be able to cast such a cloud over someone without having to provide evidence or give them a right of reply.

You have condemed him based soley on her testimony as have many others.

[Scott]

I know of a few women here in Melbourne that would do anything to be with AFL footballers, and they have told me that they have initiated "group sex" with them and there mates.

Maybe from this point on Sportmen of all sports should carry around contracts, the women must sign and date this contract before any contact is made and a detailed summary is made of the events that have occured. This way no woman or Man can come out years later go on national TV and say I didn't want this to happen.

[Crazyman]

TMFB, I don't think you will find that Sismis or his mate are condoning the actions involved by Matty Johns or his colleagues, however, for something to have been investigated with no charges laid and no action taken to be aired the way it has been is totally wrong and if I were Matty Johns, I would be looking at legal action for defamation...

From what I have seen & heard, it appears that Johns had already dealt with the issues and he and his family had moved on and now 6 or 7 years later a report is aired on national television dredging up old memories that no-one wants.

On this one, I am with Sismis in that the reporters should have left names out of it...even if the club concerned was named (i.e. Cronulla Sharks)...

Additionally, the NRL should keep their noses out of Matt John's private contracts with other parties. If the NRL decides to axe him, that is their choice. If they decide they don't want to negotiate with 9 because of him, again their choice, but they have no place in pre-empting discussions with the network and effectively forcing 9's hand in regards to taking action over an incident that occured prior to him being employed with them & where charges weren't laid and no action taken...

Personally, I think she did the right thing coming forward and telling about it, however, 4 Corners have crossed the line by naming names and dragging people and their families through the mud when there was no need for it...

[The Man from Bomberland]

TMFB, I don't think you will find that Sismis or his mate are condoning the actions involved by Matty Johns or his colleagues, however, for something to have been investigated with no charges laid and no action taken to be aired the way it has been is totally wrong and if I were Matty Johns, I would be looking at legal action for defamation...

From what I have seen & heard, it appears that Johns had already dealt with the issues and he and his family had moved on and now 6 or 7 years later a report is aired on national television dredging up old memories that no-one wants.

On this one, I am with Sismis in that the reporters should have left names out of it...even if the club concerned was named (i.e. Cronulla Sharks)...

Additionally, the NRL should keep their noses out of Matt John's private contracts with other parties. If the NRL decides to axe him, that is their choice. If they decide they don't want to negotiate with 9 because of him, again their choice, but they have no place in pre-empting discussions with the network and effectively forcing 9's hand in regards to taking action over an incident that occured prior to him being employed with them & where charges weren't laid and no action taken...

Personally, I think she did the right thing coming forward and telling about it, however, 4 Corners have crossed the line by naming names and dragging people and their families through the mud when there was no need for it...

Johns is the star rugby league personality for Channel 9 - the only network who broadcast NRL games on free to air . The NRL have every right to express their views on the matter.

[swoodley]

A mate of mine who is from Sydney and keeps up with all things NRL told me that this situation was dealt with soon after the event and involved a very large brown paper bag being given to the woman in order to keep it quiet.

One thing that I find interesting is that if the sex was consensual at the time, why has she come out now....it's obvious that she greatly regrets what happened and that she is now going through a very difficult period but if it was consensual, then she made a bad decision at the time.

Sure tell your story, especially if it helps deal with the emotional pain, but the story could have been told without naming names...they haven't named her, have they?

[Sismis]

The NRL and Channel 9 have looked after their interests which is simply a public relations reality.

Johns media career is now in an indefinite hiatis.

The known facts:

Group sex occured which John's has admited he was a part of.

All members of the Rugby team involved have testified that the sex was consentual.

Police investigated the matter and no charges were laid.

The woman in question has stated that it has had a massive adverse effect on her. As far as I know she has not stated that it was unconsentual.


This really is a tough situation. The woman obviously feels she has been used and degraded but from a legal standpoint no crime has been commited. People engage in all sorts of sexual activities, which may seem wrong to others but as long as there is consent what people do should be their own business. One of the issues people have is that Johns has not apologised for what they see as a dispicable act, but from his point of view he may feel as if he has done nothing wrong, and may not have.

There is definatelty serious issues here about respect for women which should not be made light of. All of the codes are currently trying to clean up their act in this area. BUT there is also an issue of justice and a guy has been made a scapegoat by the media. It seems to me that he may well be paying for the sins of others.

[hillchaser]

I agree with you TMFB.

To me it doesn't matter if it was consenual or not... A drunk 19 year old vs a team of NRL players... is crazy...

People have a right within the law to act how they want ... and I can't think of all the philosophical arguements for this but the whole thing just feels wrong. Imagine if it was your sister, mum or a friend involved... These guys are just low life pigs.... imho

[Sismis]

This is why i have such a problem with the way the media has handled this.

People are mixing up their own personal feelings towards the act itself with the actual facts of the situation. This argument " Imagine if it was your sister, mum or a friend involved" is basically saying, think as emotively about this issue as you can. Which for mine is the entirely wrong frame of mind to be in to try to contemplate such a complex issue.

Hillchaser how can consent not be an issue? Everyone has to take some responsibility for their own actions.

[bomberdonnie]

If it was consensual then the only thing Johns has done wrong is cheated on his wife... Dog act but far from illegal and certainly not worthy of losing a $3m+/year career

If it wasn't consensual then he is a rapist and should go to jail

it is as simple as that

[F111]

It may have been consensual to begin with. Maybe with one player, maybe more.

At some point the whole episode overcame the girl involved....how many were in the room? At what point did consensual become non-consensual but the whole thing was too overwhelming?

Lots of info we may never know, that will allow us to make informed judgement. Maybe it should stay that way...maybe it should never have come so far. Maybe the "group sex" nrl thing just needs to be belted out of them. Maybe this is what is happening?

I spoke with 4-5 girls at work tonight and they were aghast at the circumstances with no consideration as to the other side of the story. They collectively jumped to a conclusion. I mentioned terms like consensual gang bang, gang rape etc and wondered if they were able to differentiate these from the current issue? They struggled. They felt very uneasy..I could tell...even considering consensual female agreement..at any stage. I pointed out the care required by women, and the concept of "sports moll junkie" (my term). They couldn't understand any girl would be so silly.

It's obviously very distasteful. I find it quite sickening really. This puts a minority of women in a poor light, it puts males in a very poor light and shows alcohol might be a very big factor for both.

[ealesy]

To me this reads very similarily to the Bulldogs situation that happened a few years late.

In that case the woman stated that she went back to the room with one player and had consented to have sex with him, nextr thing she knew the room was full of his teammates taking turns.

The issue is that in this situation no charges were ever going to be laid, in both situation it was one woman's word against 10+ blokes that it was completely consensual. Without any independent witnesses, there is no prospect of a conviction, and therefore, it is a waste of taxpayers' money and the DPP's time to even both laying charges. In the situation it also prevents the woman from being revictimised and be allowed to be ripped to shreds by defense counsel and made to seem like she is the biggest slut in the history of the world. So what if she is, doesn't mean she consented this particular time.

So I really don't see how the fact they were investigated and not charged is a major surprise or some indication of their innocence.

I remember after the DDP stated they were not going to lay charges against the Bulldog players, that their CEO came out and said that they had been found to be innocent, which in turn drew a very strong response from the Senior NSW Police Members that this was not the case at all.

And who the f*** cares if it was consensual or not. To me a group of professional sportsmen get a 19 year old teenage girl pissed off her face and then having group sex with her, is still revolting and degrading. It might not be illegal, but it sure demonstrates a shit poor attitude to women on their part.

Have think about this: Leigh Montanga and Stephen Milne were never charged but I know a hell of lot of people on here still refer to them as rapists!!

[Madden]

People say that she consented (at least in the beginning). I say that its not that simple. Consent is not a simple issue, and you have to wonder whether any consent given consitutes valid consent in the circumstances. She was a 19yo girl in a room with 12 rugby players. Surely you have to think that there is a possibility that consent was coerced in the circumstances.

It would have been impossible to get a conviction (because she consented in the beginning, and because its 12 people's word against 1). Just because charges weren't laid doesn't mean the behaviour wasn't potentially criminal.

I urge anyone who has doubts about this issue to watch the Four Corners story online.