The beauty of Matthew Lloyd

[andrewb]

They'll work out who has the edge over their opponent and then work on that. Lloyd was just coming back from injury and Rutten is a decent defender.
Stevens is not that good a defender and it was clear early on that Lucas would have the upper hand. So Lucas stayed in the goal square and Lloydy went up the field.

Spot on.

[BenDoolan]

Ok, I'm going to throw something else into this conversation:

Courtney Johns

Where (if at all) does he fit in?

Queen Elizabeth Oval?
Or taking the worst defender in the 1's?

Well, he's got to earn his spot now. I'm a Courtney Johns believer, but he has to display some dominating form at Bendigo IMO. He has trouble with his accuracy in the seniors. Everyone focusses on Watto, KB etc with poor kicking (and with good reason), but Johns is also a problem kicker.

[Sismis]

I love scotty as well but saying he is better than Lloyd is ridiculous.

Lloyd had AA FB on him and took him for a stroll.

Lloyd is more consistant, stronger in a contested situation and more accurate from within 50.

Lloyd is able to get his 3-4 a game being double teamed.

[Western Red]

Gee what a dilemma we have!!!! Great position to be in. I think one of the things that hasn't been mentioned is that now Lloyd is captain he doesn't need to kick bags (I am sure he will at different stages of the year) he can be the team leader do more of the team things as the pressure is off him to a degree (goals per week). He will always get the no.1 defender which will be a blessing to Lucas. They will run thier own race in regard to who plays closer to goals etc depending on match ups. They are both experienced enough and have similar game styles that it really isn't an issue who gets them as long as they go through!!

[Rossoneri]

Sissy, I dont think anybody is saying that Lucas is better than Lloyd. We are saying that there are some parts of Lucas that are better than Lloyd.
I think he is a better shot for goal and better at the contested mark.

[robrulz5]

I've always thought Scotty was the better player as Lloyd gets alot of credit for the amount of goals he kicks.

I'd keep Lloyd at full forward and Lucas at CHF as Scotty is more flexible and it will be alot easier for him to make, turn around and pump the ball forward while I think Lloydy is better at taking him time after taking a mark.

[Rover 7]

Agree with Sheedy's view that Lloyd is a very good footballer who hasn't had the opportunities to fully show his all round ability but then again Full Forwards like him are like diamonds; worth guarding with all the diligence De Beers display to theirs.
Get the ball to him in half reasonable fashion consistantly and he will do the rest as he has done for years.
Scotty is great but Lloyd has him on all counts.

The stake is there and the kindling stacked but no matches at the moment.

[84859300]

Ok, I'm going to throw something else into this conversation:

Courtney Johns

Where (if at all) does he fit in?

Queen Elizabeth Oval?
Or taking the worst defender in the 1's?

I think we can play with three talls, but its all about the speed. They will need more time together. Its a spew that Lucas and Johns were out for a couple of weeks in the PS, that would have given them some time to work together.

Lucas is not needed down back anymore, so maybe Johns to play as the third tall with Jetta, davey and Gus at his feet?

In theory, I like this set up but you may even switch Johns with Gumby to further my point. It is rare to have three backman, each of a high standard in the one team. So with Lloyd taking #1 backman. Lucas takes #2 leaving Gumby or Johns with #3 and as was mentioned above with Neagle taking #4.

I read of talk on BBlitz of dummy leads creeping into training a few weeks back. Opening up the F50 to the lessers could be a breath of fresh air.....rather than relying on Lloyd week in and week out.

It would be nice to think that we had an option like a Blake Carrasella in Neagle chipping in for 2 every two weeks to stretch the opposition backline and keep them guessing at the selction table.

Again....who do we drop to get to this position??
It's great having too many choices

[hop]

Don't forget that Scotty kicked 45 goals more than the next bomber last year. He is an out and out champ who has been putting his head down and arse up for years!

Lloyd is a Superstar who will kick more than a 1,000 goals by the end of his career and will lead his team with great distinction. (and hopefully a premiership or two)

As has already been stated - what a dilemma. - WHAT AN OPPORTUNITY!!!!

Mix in a little Jetta, add a pinch of Davey, a healthy serving of Hird, garnished with a salad of Johns, Hille, Laycock, Johnson and Lovett and you have a feast for the ages.

Opportunity and hunger is there - keeping them healthy is going to be the challenge.

[BenDoolan]

There's no point arguing who's better, they are both champions. However, it is interesting to note that Scott Lucas has won a B & F playing at CHB. He has also won a B & F playing at CHF / FF. Matthew Lloyd hasn't won a B & F. Some might say it is very difficult for a full forward to win one.......but Dustin Fletcher won one at full back when Lloyd kicked 109 goals at the other end! Wierd huh...

[pevfan]

They kicked 9 between tham on Sunday, if they can average near that most games I'll be very happy. I don't care how it comes 5/4 to Lloydy, 6/3 to Scotty or even 8/1 to whichever. I'm sure each will prove a great foil for the other and will take the one dimensional play out of our game plan that has been our problem for years now, even before Lloydy wnt down last year.

[dingus]

I'm expecting my invitation to the next tactics meeting to hit my inbox at any time.

[Rossoneri]

And Lloyd proved again how good he is, and vinticated Sissys point. Lloyd can be reasonably quiet, yet still kick 4 goals, like on Sunday.

[dingus]

He is indeed a champion. My point all along though, is that I think the team will be better served with Lucas at FF and Lloydy busting heads and packs around the ground all day. If he can do that and average 3 goals a week, not only will we win more games thatn we lose, but he will win the Brownlow.

[tom9779]

I will get burned at the stake for this, but I still think that Lucas is a better shot for goal than Lloyd, a better mark than Lloyd in a contested situation and a better field kick than Lloyd as well.

The difference in the two is consistency and also the fact that Lloydy is out in the media more, whereas Lucas is you typical modest workhorse type of footballer.

Gets his tools, goes to work, then goes home.

I dont want to sound like Lloyd doesnt deserve his congratulatory back slaps, but Lucas is so underrated by everybody outside Essendon it is quite sickening. Of course, Scotty wouldnt mind that, but others at Essendon do.

Hate to admit it, but i totally agree with you ross. Only one thing, i think that Lloyd is a better shot for goal than Lucas inside 40. But anywhere else it would be Lucas.

I reckon he is a better kick inside the 40m than Lloyd.
However, its good when you can feel confident when either of them have be. But you can only get lucy if you give yourself a chance to get lucky.

Sorry but I would have to try burning you both at the stake.
Lloyd is probably the best set shot kick for goal in the AFL.

Career shots for goal Lloyd: 769 goals 350 behinds. accuracy: 69%
Career shots for goal Lucas: 377 goals 262 behinds. accuracy: 59%

Ok Lloyd has predominantly played at FF and maybe you would expect a high percentage.(for reference plugger was approx 70% as well).

And to compare apples with apples(ie CHF to CHF) careys accuracy was approx 66% .

Nevermind, I personally think Lucas is the most valuable forward running around. His goals from outside 50 are worth their weight in gold.

[azza78]

and it means the Messiah has to force his way in on the back of his form, as opposed to last year when Lloyd's injury almost guaranteed him a game.

Gee it's bloody nice to have depth and list pressure...

[F111]

Career shots for goal Lloyd: 769 goals 350 behinds. accuracy: 69%
Career shots for goal Lucas: 377 goals 262 behinds. accuracy: 59%

I'd like to see the numbers for their last 20 games or last 100 goals compared...an up to date comparo.

[BenDoolan]

I think it's fair to say that Lucas will have a crack from outside 50 and generally slot them while Lloydy wouldn't even make the distance. But generally speaking, you would want Lloydy with the ball 40 metres out to have a shot with your life depending on it.

[The Man from Bomberland]

I think it's fair to say that Lucas will have a crack from outside 50 and generally slot them while Lloydy wouldn't even make the distance. But generally speaking, you would want Lloydy with the ball 40 metres out to have a shot with your life depending on it.

Not really I don't think he's as reliable inside 40m as some make out. He's missed a fair few easy ones in his career. With Lloydy I never think he's a certainty to kick it, regardless of where he's kicking from.

Still f****** good to see him on the paddock. I've missed my boy.

[bueller]

I still think Lloyd is a better contested mark than Lucas and generally a better athlete.
Although, i think Lucas has improved in that area, he normally takes marks on a lead rather than a contested situation whereas i've seen the skipper take all sorts of marks over the years.
As for kicking, they can both kick goals outside 50 and are generally very accurate, however sometimes Scotty can be a slightly erratic closer to goal but seems to have more shots further out than Lloyd - due to their positions on the ground.