I'm pissed off

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j-mac31
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I'm pissed off

Post by j-mac31 »

Haven't been on here for a while so I kinda missed the proper time to mention this but anyway...

I thought Lloyd's stupid hit on Caroll was an absolutely disgraceful act. He should seriously be ashamed of himself.

This is the guy who when made captain, decided to seriously fix up the discipline at the club. This was an act of no discipline at all. Just one idiot trying to get back at another idiot for an equally stupid bump. Not the same as staying out late like Cole and Jetta, but discipline is needed on the field as well as off. Great leadership. :roll:

And yes, it was a pretty soft suspension, but you should not put yourself in a position to be suspended.

And then McVeigh goes and does something even stupider and Fletcher as well, both also getting suspended for one. More great leadership and setting a brilliant example from senior players, but it seriously hurts the team too.
We were close for three quarters without Lloyd, maybe we would have won with him.
McVeigh would have been more than handy against the quick Bulldogs and Fletcher could have dominated the air down back.
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Post by nathanskinner »

totally agree.
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Jazz_84
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Post by Jazz_84 »

thats definitely a valid point, and a very good one at that

it's an aspect of the whole Lloyd incident that no-one bothered to mention, i dont even think Lloyd himself gave it too much thought

everyone was just sidetracked because they were pissed off at the end result

impressive j-mac :)
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BenDoolan
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Post by BenDoolan »

Well, that's a fair point. Over the past three games we have lost David Hille (last year's captain in Lloyd's absence), Lloyd himself (the captain) and Fletcher & McVeigh (both inform leaders themselves). Staggering considering the great restraint they have shown towards umpires. Perhaps their restraint in blowing off steam at the umpires is now being aimed at the opposition players......
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Post by paddyl90 »

I didn't have the same opinion but looking back on it...thats actually a really good point :| and a valid one too.
Last edited by paddyl90 on Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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swoodley
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Post by swoodley »

I think you'll find that only a few of us actually agree with you j-mac (if you read through the various threads on these topics, you'll see what I'm saying)

But you are so right and well done for pointing it out so clearly.
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spikefan
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Post by spikefan »

I completely agree and as pointed out somewhere else McVeigh did apologize for having let the team down. I am quite concerned playing the Bulldogs without Fletch and Spike.

One might agree with this thread and also think the suspension of Lloyd and McVeigh was too harsh in view of the recent tribunal decisions. These are completely different matters...
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Megan
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Post by Megan »

It's always interesting to note that two incidents can be identical, but one is bad if they're defending themselves, but acceptable if they're flying the flag.

Not a go at anyone - I don't even remember the circumstances in which Lloyd copped it - but I remember Macca was just roughing Precious up and Fletch, well he seemed frustrated.
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Megan
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Post by Megan »

It's always interesting to note that two incidents can be identical, but one is bad if they're defending themselves, but acceptable if they're flying the flag.

Not a go at anyone - I don't even remember the circumstances in which Lloyd copped it - but I remember Macca was just roughing Precious up and Fletch, well he seemed frustrated.
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BenDoolan
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Post by BenDoolan »

spikefan wrote:I completely agree and as pointed out somewhere else McVeigh did apologize for having let the team down. I am quite concerned playing the Bulldogs without Fletch and Spike.

One might agree with this thread and also think the suspension of Lloyd and McVeigh was too harsh in view of the recent tribunal decisions. These are completely different matters...
Totally agree with you there.

Just because we may see the guys who got suspended showed a lack of leadership, it doesn't mean we think the process applied to both Lloyd & McVeigh was justified. In light of the rubbish that has been let go this year, their suspensions are an abomination.

And I maintain that they are corrupt bastards.
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Post by Sismis »

I wonder how many of you play competitive sport?

Sometimes you have to fly the flag and not let your opponent get a mental edge over you.

I'm sorry but i don't want a whole team of "Jolly good game old chap, yes you got me a good one there, tally-ho" type players.

Lloyds fireing up may well have won us the game.

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Post by Jazz_84 »

haha also a good point!!
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spikefan
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Post by spikefan »

Sismis wrote:I wonder how many of you play competitive sport?

Sometimes you have to fly the flag and not let your opponent get a mental edge over you.

I'm sorry but i don't want a whole team of "Jolly good game old chap, yes you got me a good one there, tally-ho" type players.

Lloyds fireing up may well have won us the game.
Simple solution, you fly the flag AND you don't get a free against, you don't get a 50m penalty and certainly not get suspended for it.:wink:

Could Lloydy have put Nathan Carroll back in his place without one week suspension?
Could Spike have sparred with Ablett without getting a week?

The answer is yes, because they are both seasoned professionals and damn good at their job. Except this time they got suspended which possibly could cost us a game.
This is why it is so important to have the MRP fair and consistent.
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BenDoolan
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Post by BenDoolan »

Just thought I would give you some examples of some players (who happen to represent interstate clubs) that have received a let off by the MRP / tribunal process. Judge for yourselves.

I particularly like the Daniel Merrett one.....you know....the one where it was Alwyn Davey's fault because he is too fast! :lol:

Or even the Chris Johnson one where he headbutted Shane Parker....but wait...his head didn't contact Parker's head, it contacted his chest and NO FURTHER ACTION WAS REQUIRED. :lol: Tell that one to McVeigh!

f****** corruption.

1. Contact between West Coast's Beau Waters and St Kilda's Steven Baker from the third quarter of Sunday's match was reviewed. Due to insufficient video evidence, no further action could be taken.

2. Michael Wilson , Port Adelaide, has accepted a reprimand and 70.31 points towards his future record for striking Henry Slattery, Essendon, during the third quarter of the round 12 match between Port Adelaide and Essendon at AAMI Stadium on Sunday June 17, 2007.

3. Contact between Sydney's Leo Barry and Geelong's Cameron Ling from the second quarter of Saturday's match was reviewed. The panel said that considerable contact in the bump was made to Ling's chest area, with some contact to the Geelong player's chin. It was deemed that the force of the bump was not excessive in the situation while the player being bumped (Ling) was actively involved in the play. Further, Barry did not run a long distance to make contact with his opponent and Ling was not in a vulnerable position. Barry did not leave the ground or raise his elbow in the bumping action and, when considering all these factors, it was deemed not to be a reportable offence and no further action was required.

4. Contact between Port Adelaide's Warren Tredrea and the Brisbane Lions' Daniel Merrett from the third quarter of Saturday's match was reviewed. The panel said that Tredrea swung his arm into Merrett, with an open hand, and contact was made to Merrett's arms. The action was not deemed reportable and no further action was required.

5. Contact between the Brisbane Lions' Jamie Charman and West Coast's Andrew Embley from the first quarter of Saturday's match was reviewed. It was the view of the panel that Charman had his eyes on the ball and attempted to spoil Embley's chest mark. The Brisbane player made contact with Embley's arm and incidental contact was made to his opponent's face. No further action was required.

6. The panel assessed the match day report laid against Port Adelaide's Justin Westhoff, who was reported for charging Hawthorn's Clinton Young during Sunday's game at AAMI Stadium. It was the view of the panel that Westhoff was running in from the side to a marking contest. He had his eyes on the ball at all times until a split-second before contact was made. At that moment, when the player realised contact was unavoidable, Westhoff turned to protect himself. The incident was not deemed as reportable and no further action taken.

7. Contact between Sydney's Ryan O'Keefe and Essendon's Jason Winderlich from the second quarter of Saturday's match was reviewed. The panel said that O'Keefe's lower arm made contact with Winderlich's head in an attempt to spoil the ball. The action was seen as a legitimate attempt to spoil the ball, given the close proximity of the ball, and no further action was taken.


8. Chris Judd, West Coast, has been charged with misconduct in that he eyegouged Campbell Brown, Hawthorn, during the third quarter of the Round Nine match between West Coast and Hawthorn, played at Aurora Stadium on Saturday May 26, 2007. In summary, his prior record means that the sanction must remain at one match. The incident was assessed as negligent conduct (one point), low impact (one point) and high contact (two points). This is a total of four activation points, resulting in a classification of a Level One offence, drawing 125 demerit points and a one-match sanction. He has an existing record of one match suspended
within the last three years, which increases the penalty by 10 per cent to 137.50 points. An early plea would reduce the sanction by 25 per cent to a 103.13 points and a one-match sanction. Result? He got off!

9. Heath Black, Fremantle, has been charged with engaging in rough conduct against Andrew McQualter, St Kilda, during the fourth quarter of the Round Nine match between Fremantle and St Kilda, played at Subiaco on Friday May 25, 2007. In summary, he can accept a reprimand and 93.75 points towards his future record with an early plea. The incident was assessed as negligent conduct (one point), low impact (one point) and body contact (one point). This is a total of three activation points, resulting in a classification of a Level One offence, drawing 125 demerit points and a one-match sanction. He has no existing good or bad record. An early plea
reduces the sanction by 25 per cent to a reprimand and 93.75 points towards his future record.

10. Contact between the Brisbane Lions' Daniel Merrett and Essendon's Alwyn Davey from the third quarter of Saturday's match was reviewed. It was the view of the panel that Merrett's action was not considered to be a striking motion. The force of the contact was due to the speed of the Essendon player, heading into the collision, and not the action of Merrett. Therefore, the incident was considered not to be a reportable offence and no further action was taken. Laughable!

11. The match day report laid against the Brisbane Lions' Chris Johnson, for headbutting Fremantle's Shane Parker during the second quarter was assessed. it was the view of the panel that Johnson's head did not make contact with Parker's head. The force to Parker's chest was below that required to constitute a reportable offence and no further action was required. Would be good if they viewed every case this way....

12. Adam Goodes, Sydney, has been charged with charging Simon Godfrey, Melbourne, during the fourth quarter of the Round Five match between Sydney and Melbourne, played at the SCG on Saturday April 28, 2007. The incident was assessed as intentional conduct (three points), low impact (one point) and body contact (one point). This is a total of five activation points, resulting in a classification of a Level Two offence, drawing 225 demerit points and a two-match sanction. He has an existing five-year good record, which reduces the penalty by 25 per cent to 168.75 demerit points and a one-match sanction. Result? He got off!!!!

13. Des Headland, Fremantle, has been charged with one offence for striking Adam Selwood, West Coast, during the third quarter of the Round Three match between Fremantle and West Coast, played at Subiaco on Saturday April 14, 2007. The incident was assessed as intentional conduct (three points), low impact (one point) and high contact (two points). This is a total of six activation points, which relates to a Level Three Offence, drawing 225 demerit points and a two-match sanction. He has an existing poor record of four matches suspended within the last three years, which increases his penalty by 40 per cent to 315 points and he also has 31.25 demerit points carried over from within the last 12 months, which increases his penalty to 346.25 points and a three-match sanction.
Des Headland, Fremantle, has been charged with another offence for striking Adam Selwood, West Coast, during the third quarter of the Round Three match between Fremantle and West Coast, played at Subiaco on Saturday April 14, 2007. The incident was assessed as intentional conduct (three points), low impact (one point) and high contact (two points). This is a total of six activation points, which relates to a Level Three Offence, drawing 225 demerit points and a two-match Result? He got off!!!!!
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Post by spikefan »

Great post, I started the same and gave up, too busy or too lazy.

Interesting, a scientific mind would at least investigate an interesting correlation between playing interstate and getting your transgressions overlooked.

But apparently some of our young lawyers think everything is OK, so you must be wrong :wink:
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boncer34
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Post by boncer34 »

Said the exact same thing straight after the incedent and didnt find people quite so receptive.
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Post by Madden »

Do I think Essendon get a good run at the Tribunal? No.

Do I think that there is a systematic conspiracy where the Tribunal and the AFL are deliberately corrupt in relation to Essendon? Hell no.
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BenDoolan
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Post by BenDoolan »

Staggy wrote:Do I think Essendon get a good run at the Tribunal? No.

Do I think that there is a systematic conspiracy where the Tribunal and the AFL are deliberately corrupt in relation to Essendon? Hell no.
Maybe not toward Essendon, but certainly seems to find a hell of a lot of excuses for other clubs and their players. I could go back over the years, but it's too tedious.
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Post by Essendon4eva »

Disagree j-mac.
Carrol knocked Lloyd on his ass and he wasn't going to lay down and take it.
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j-mac31
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Post by j-mac31 »

Essendon4eva wrote:Disagree j-mac.
Carrol knocked Lloyd on his ass and he wasn't going to lay down and take it.
I think that's what Sismis was getting at too. But as Spikefan said, you can fly the flag without getting suspended.

There are rules in sports and no matter the circumstances, you can't break them.

And what would have been the reaction here if it had been Neitz retaliating to Michael?

My main point anyway was that Lloyd's act was doubly stupid after his strong stance on improving the discipline at the club.

I'm sure we all agree with this...
Image

But...

Who else reckons we were lucky once: Hille? Given that Lloyd, McVeigh and Fletcher each got one week for not much and the way the tribunal has gone with head-high contact I reckon Hille was very lucky not to get 2 or 3 seeing as Cornes was over the footy.
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