23 and under

[Gossy7]

Jimmy and the blokes in charge are happy with him. Maybe Browne doesn't like him but I'll stick to listening to some others.

Was just personal opinion. Fair call.

[boncer34]

Jimmy and the blokes in charge are happy with him. Maybe Browne doesn't like him but I'll stick to listening to some others.

Was just personal opinion. Fair call.

Opinions is what this forum is built on.

Or should I say differing opinions.

[jimmyc1985]

Bit harsh aren't you Gossy to be rubbishing a bloke we picked up with pick #80 in the fifth round of an ordinary draft? Most of the guys drafted in the fifth round have obvious deficiencies in their game and the odds are heavily stacked against them making it to 100+ AFL games.

[robbie67]

[
The only statement I totally disagree with you on is "every time this year that one of the better sides made us play them one on one, our talent was miles away from being up to it"....we are the equal in talent in most cases or better in a few but are years away physically hopefully being adressed in the next 6 months....or the start of said addressing.

Well Filth, this is something you also say almost every year. You continually say how it's not the talent that's the problem, first it was Sheedy, then it was Quinn, then it was Knights.......................it's always something, but heaven forbid, anyone wearing red and black just being oridinary.

Did you have a look at the AA Team named earlier in the week? That's the fourth year in a row we havent got a player in it. We are the first club to achieve this somewhat dubious honour since Freo entered the league and missed out from 95 through 01. I'm sure you have many conspiracy theories as to why this is so, but we have been also rans for 10 seasons in a row now. Talent wise, we are all but irrelevent, apart from a handful of youngsters that we are all hoping can lead the club out of the wilderness. Stop talking though like it's going to happen soon, it's not. We are going to have to draft, and maybe trade perfectly in the next couple of years, and then we will need to give those kids the time to develop the bodies required. Then we will need luck, and patientce, and the more our list is over-rated, the less likely we will have the patientce that is going to be a neccessity.

[filthy2]

Rob do you really take notice of that rubbish that is the AA Team that forever can't find a place for Fletch and had Hird on a bench? It is a joke.

By isolating the 23 and unders I identified 21 out of 36 players after the Gnome and poor DD went.

The best 10 of those are amongst the best young blokes I have seen come into our Club for a long time and Hepp aside it is the only thing that we can say "Thank you" to MK for.

So as always...we'll see.

PS If that AA thing was credible, and if Jobe idn't miss 7 from injury and looking at his 1st 5 games where he SHOULD get 10-15 Chas votes, if he hadn't got injured, do you reckon he would have made AA? I am still thinking not. We missed 150+ player games to injury (not including Gumby)...only Freo was worse.

Not helpful I would have thought.

[robbie67]

Yes Filth, just as I suspected, its the AA selectors fault. Flecther hasnt been in the top 5 in our B&F for a number of years now, but you think he deserves a place in the AA team? Get serious. Watson? Haha, come on, just which one of the mid-fielders would he replace? But whatever, if it's not Quinn, it's Vlad, or Maggots, or Sheedy, or Knights, or the guy who picks on Hibberd in Frankston, or the guy used to sell the peanuts at Windy Hill. Oh not to mention the facilities, which is the biggest joke of all. If Michael Hurley fell over walking down the street, you would blame the pavement.

You can crap on about the 10 great young blokes all you like, but you know that history shows that at least 3 of them wont make it to the heights you imagine. And when you take the rose coloured glasses off, IF Bellchambers improves he will replace Hille, and IF Pears gets better he will replace Fletcher, so even IF those two make it, we dont actually improve, but just replace good existing players that we have. Of course, that is a necessity, but it doesnt make you any better. No doubt Hurley, Zaka, Hep all will be very good at the least, but the jury is still out on all of the others including Paddy. Not one of the guys you have mentioned has strung together two good seasons of football, including the three I think probably cant miss.

Miles away Filth.................only a fool would convince themselves otherwise.

[Gossy7]

Bit harsh aren't you Gossy to be rubbishing a bloke we picked up with pick #80 in the fifth round of an ordinary draft? Most of the guys drafted in the fifth round have obvious deficiencies in their game and the odds are heavily stacked against them making it to 100+ AFL games.

No. Not at all. Regardless of if he was a number 1 or 80 it doesn't take a way the fact that he won't play 100+ games, let alone 50. He's no good and won't be any good.

[danstar84]

Bit harsh aren't you Gossy to be rubbishing a bloke we picked up with pick #80 in the fifth round of an ordinary draft? Most of the guys drafted in the fifth round have obvious deficiencies in their game and the odds are heavily stacked against them making it to 100+ AFL games.

No. Not at all. Regardless of if he was a number 1 or 80 it doesn't take a way the fact that he won't play 100+ games, let alone 50. He's no good and won't be any good.

No way you can tell after a year. Odds are, like Jimmy said that he won't make it, but you never know. Needs another year or two to make a proper judgement.

I'm sure most people thought that Crameri was gone last year, and look at him now.

[BenDoolan]

Bit harsh aren't you Gossy to be rubbishing a bloke we picked up with pick #80 in the fifth round of an ordinary draft? Most of the guys drafted in the fifth round have obvious deficiencies in their game and the odds are heavily stacked against them making it to 100+ AFL games.

No. Not at all. Regardless of if he was a number 1 or 80 it doesn't take a way the fact that he won't play 100+ games, let alone 50. He's no good and won't be any good.

No way you can tell after a year. Odds are, like Jimmy said that he won't make it, but you never know. Needs another year or two to make a proper judgement.

I'm sure most people thought that Crameri was gone last year, and look at him now.

Very, very true.

[Gossy7]

Bit harsh aren't you Gossy to be rubbishing a bloke we picked up with pick #80 in the fifth round of an ordinary draft? Most of the guys drafted in the fifth round have obvious deficiencies in their game and the odds are heavily stacked against them making it to 100+ AFL games.

No. Not at all. Regardless of if he was a number 1 or 80 it doesn't take a way the fact that he won't play 100+ games, let alone 50. He's no good and won't be any good.

No way you can tell after a year. Odds are, like Jimmy said that he won't make it, but you never know. Needs another year or two to make a proper judgement.

I'm sure most people thought that Crameri was gone last year, and look at him now.

Yet I havn't seen his progress for a year. I've seen it for the last 10 years. I know the sorts of blokes that can make it, and those who can't/won't. Like his brother, simply won't make it.

[filthy2]

Of course we are miles away Rob....that is why I pulled the 23 and below out to highlight:

a) There is some young serious talent there making up what? 66% of the list. 21 players.

b) They have years and now a serious EFC from the Pres down in place to ensure they will be the best they can be going forward.

I would have thought that Melksham in his only first 2 years has shown enough that he will be up there with the Hepps and so on, Crameri left a huge hole when he went down just before the finals and Pears is rated our best back according to Lloydy so.....

As regards the past, you get a sore neck looking back....let us look foward with a bit more confidence at least.

As I say we'll see. Happily it won't be for want of effort or money (anymore the latter).

[gringo]

Of course we are miles away Rob....that is why I pulled the 23 and below out to highlight:

a) There is some young serious talent there making up what? 66% of the list. 21 players.

b) They have years and now a serious EFC from the Pres down in place to ensure they will be the best they can be going forward.

I would have thought that Melksham in his only first 2 years has shown enough that he will be up there with the Hepps and so on, Crameri left a huge hole when he went down just before the finals and Pears is rated our best back according to Lloydy so.....

As regards the past, you get a sore neck looking back....let us look foward with a bit more confidence at least.

As I say we'll see. Happily it won't be for want of effort or money (anymore the latter).

I'm not sure what the all the fuss is about regarding Melksham. He's not particularly skilled, not particularly quick, not really a ball winner and not very big. I've never seen him grab a game, or even part of a game by the scruff of the neck and really change the shape of it. To compare him To Heppell is folly.

[Windy_Hill]

Wouldnt it be best to judge the real value of these guys when they have 40-50 games under their belts? Its rare to see a young kid hit his potential before this milestone.

[Gatsid]

Bit harsh aren't you Gossy to be rubbishing a bloke we picked up with pick #80 in the fifth round of an ordinary draft? Most of the guys drafted in the fifth round have obvious deficiencies in their game and the odds are heavily stacked against them making it to 100+ AFL games.

No. Not at all. Regardless of if he was a number 1 or 80 it doesn't take a way the fact that he won't play 100+ games, let alone 50. He's no good and won't be any good.

No way you can tell after a year. Odds are, like Jimmy said that he won't make it, but you never know. Needs another year or two to make a proper judgement.

I'm sure most people thought that Crameri was gone last year, and look at him now.

Yet I havn't seen his progress for a year. I've seen it for the last 10 years. I know the sorts of blokes that can make it, and those who can't/won't. Like his brother, simply won't make it.

Not disagreeing with you, because I'll admit I know next to nothing on the guy apart from his limited exposure this year, but why won't he make it? What's he distinctively lacking? For instance is easy to say Slattery won't make it because he lacks skill, constantly gives away stupid free kicks, etc. From what we saw of Ross, he looked ok, nothing special but I didn't pick up on anything that he was horrible at so to speak. From what you're saying I'm guessing you've either played with or against him, what haven't we yet seen that we're going to see?

[j-mac31]

I'm with Robbie. Yes, it looks like a good list and I'm certainly feeling better about the young players on the list than possibly ever, but until they do anything, it counts for dick.

[j-mac31]

I'm not sure what the all the fuss is about regarding Melksham. He's not particularly skilled, not particularly quick, not really a ball winner and not very big. I've never seen him grab a game, or even part of a game by the scruff of the neck and really change the shape of it. To compare him To Heppell is folly.

I think he's looked pretty good for a two year player and he goes in when it's his turn, but I do think he needs plenty of improvement if he's going to be very good. AT this stage he probably projects to be a good 4th or 5th midfielder at best.

[robbie67]

Wouldnt it be best to judge the real value of these guys when they have 40-50 games under their belts? Its rare to see a young kid hit his potential before this milestone.

This.

Some will make it, some wont. Our problems wont be solved overnight, it's a long process.

[ZeroEffect]

I'm not sure what the all the fuss is about regarding Melksham. He's not particularly skilled, not particularly quick, not really a ball winner and not very big. I've never seen him grab a game, or even part of a game by the scruff of the neck and really change the shape of it. To compare him To Heppell is folly.

I think he's looked pretty good for a two year player and he goes in when it's his turn, but I do think he needs plenty of improvement if he's going to be very good. AT this stage he probably projects to be a good 4th or 5th midfielder at best.

He still has a very light frame, hopefully he fills out over summer and grows into a man. Give him time and he'll be very good player for a very long time. Not every bloke can be a ready made AFL player like Heppell and Hurley. Look at Dane Swan, you wouldn't say he was particularly skilled, quick or big and he spent years in the system before he came good. Now he's a superstar, hopefully we are sitting on a future superstar.