Bombertalk

Winderlich, if I was a coach I'd just tell him to run and run and just back himself, in my opinion his best games that's what he's done.

Monfries and Slattery do need to take the next step. Gus needs more time in the middle and only resting up forward. His last few games we saw how creative he can be and no one questions his courage and commitment. I remember when he played in the U18 carnival for SA, he was their main midfielder and a game against Vic Country picked up over 30 possies and in one quarter absolutely cut them up.

Slatts is honest but does need to get more of the footy but the potential is there.

Agree with McPhee, he is too loose as a KPP, but on the other sides third or fourth forward is very creative and his run out of the backline is generally very good.

As far as NLM, he hasn't been the only one to let himself down with poor skills and decision making....thankfully this is one of Knights' main objectives so we'll see how that goes. NLM's endeavour as you pointed out is undoubted.

Lovett, I'd actually like him to be given the odd tag job to teach him to play accountable footy. He has an abundance of speed, might teach him a few tricks and committed one on one with an opponent I think he could come up trumps.

Talking about midfield, has there been any news on Peverill????

Pevrill will stay.

Lovett doesnt have the attitude for a tagging job.

Monfries, with more time in the middle will be an elite player, dont worry about that. I am tipping him to be the biggest improver next year.

Lovett would be one of our "lazy" players in my opinion.

Most of our skill and decision making problems are players taking lazy options.

I would be thinking that under a new coach everyone is at square one and anyone who can't get their attitude right to perform a particular role for the team, might be spending a fair bit of time running around with Bendigo.

I read the article with great interest and relish. Matthew Knights has made all the right moves and decisions so far. As I explained in other posts (probably now deleted) I was initially sceptical about Knights' appointment but having heard what he has had to say I am won over and sold.

I am very pleased with his decision regarding Dyson. It has been my long held belief that this guy has never really been given a real go so far in his career. The only period he was given generous game time from memory was at the end of 2006 and he was quite impressive in those games. However this year he then was relegated back to the 2's and was given limited game time on the few occasions he was selected this year. I reckon he just lost confidence and was confused as to what his role was. With the coach 100% behind him, you will see a rejuvenated player on a mission. That also could be said of quite a few of the younger players in the team.

I am really looking forward to 2008.

Filthy wrote:Ross and Col....lack of the use of the skills the guys obviously have (otherwise they wouldn't be still on an AFL list) is often a case of what is going on between the ears.

These young guys now know from a coach closer to their age than Kevin and therefore closer to having played recently, that:

- They will get a game if fit enough..to his satisfaction.

- They will NOT be yanked off the ground the nanosecond they make a blue.

- They will be played in position.

- They will be playing to clearly defined, heavily drilled game plan.

The Coach WILL have CONFIDENCE in them and will persist with them and give them game time (I bet Dyson got a hard on when he heard he was going to get 80-90 minutes game time in mid field rotations).

All this clutter is therefore eradicated from their heads....they don't have to worry about that....they only have to concentrate on being fit, building their skills base and playing to the game plan. This in turn builds their confidence and the more confident they become, the better they'll play.

I think you're guilty of talking common sense now

I agree with pretty much of all of the above positivity. Good posting Col & Filthy.

Just one thing though, regarding "the Dyson defence"; namely, that he consistently got shafted for game time under Sheedy and that constitutes a mitigating or, in some people's analysis, an altogether exculpatory factor which excuses him for his failings over the last two years or so.

The problem i see with this is that, when selected for Bendigo in the VFL, Dyson got heaps of game time in nearly every game and still didn't do much. If we're to excuse his performances at AFL level on the basis that he didn't get enough game time, on what basis can we excuse his indifferent form in the VFL when he's had ample game time?

The best excuse i can come up with that applies to Dyson's mediocre form in both the VFL and AFL is that he needs to be in a good team and surrounded by good players to play his best footy. If we improve significantly as a team then i think Dyson may find himself to be a valued member of the team, but if we struggle next year as a team, i'm guessing Dyson won't give a yelp either.

Knights has been talking about addressing all the easy issues:

1. Modernise the coaching structure.... tick
2. Focus on skills and fitness... tick
3. Play the kids... I hope we'll get a tick here, too.

Should have all been done years ago. Unfortunately, he hasn't addressed the key areas:

1. Hird (1st B/F) retired, Fletcher (2nd B/F), Lucas (3rd B/F), Lloyd all 30+
2. Complete lack of depth in the "prime" age areas of the list.

In three years we will have no Lloyd, Lucas or Fletcher and we can reasonably expect that the three of them will see progressively less time on the field as age takes its toll. As yet, we don't have the real "stars" coming through to replace them.

Hardwick promised to make the tough decisions. If that was getting rid of one of our key players or a marquee forward and suffering a couple of years in the wilderness then so be it. Anyone who thinks that Knights has made any difficult decisions to date is way off the mark. Cole? Campo? Bradley? Bolton? MJ? Ayres? Wallis? Rama? They were the easy ones.

These are the teams that we'll most likely be trying to beat for a flag in three years:

Geelong
Hawthorn
Port Adelaide
Collingwood
Brisbane
West Coast

Have a look at their lists and the age of their key players. Can anyone tell me that our list in three years will be even close to those?

I'm not saying that Knights hasn't done a good job so far, but I definitely think that a premiership by 2010 is extremely bullish.

andrewb wrote:Knights has been talking about addressing all the easy issues:

1. Modernise the coaching structure.... tick
2. Focus on skills and fitness... tick
3. Play the kids... I hope we'll get a tick here, too.

Should have all been done years ago. Unfortunately, he hasn't addressed the key areas:

1. Hird (1st B/F) retired, Fletcher (2nd B/F), Lucas (3rd B/F), Lloyd all 30+
2. Complete lack of depth in the "prime" age areas of the list.

In three years we will have no Lloyd, Lucas or Fletcher and we can reasonably expect that the three of them will see progressively less time on the field as age takes its toll. As yet, we don't have the real "stars" coming through to replace them.

Hardwick promised to make the tough decisions. If that was getting rid of one of our key players or a marquee forward and suffering a couple of years in the wilderness then so be it. Anyone who thinks that Knights has made any difficult decisions to date is way off the mark. Cole? Campo? Bradley? Bolton? MJ? Ayres? Wallis? Rama? They were the easy ones.

These are the teams that we'll most likely be trying to beat for a flag in three years:

Geelong
Hawthorn
Port Adelaide
Collingwood
Brisbane
West Coast

Have a look at their lists and the age of their key players. Can anyone tell me that our list in three years will be even close to those?

I'm not saying that Knights hasn't done a good job so far, but I definitely think that a premiership by 2010 is extremely bullish.

That can be put down to poor recruiting, which is why we dont have any 'stars' in the age group from 24-27. Pretty hard for knights to be blamed for that when he hasnt been at a draft yet. The reason he is pushing the younger kids through would be so in 3 years time, blokes like Stanton, Watson, Lovett, Winderlich (older i know), monfries, slattery, Ryder etc will be near their prime or at it by that stage.

Rossoneri wrote:

andrewb wrote:Knights has been talking about addressing all the easy issues:

1. Modernise the coaching structure.... tick
2. Focus on skills and fitness... tick
3. Play the kids... I hope we'll get a tick here, too.

Should have all been done years ago. Unfortunately, he hasn't addressed the key areas:

1. Hird (1st B/F) retired, Fletcher (2nd B/F), Lucas (3rd B/F), Lloyd all 30+
2. Complete lack of depth in the "prime" age areas of the list.

In three years we will have no Lloyd, Lucas or Fletcher and we can reasonably expect that the three of them will see progressively less time on the field as age takes its toll. As yet, we don't have the real "stars" coming through to replace them.

Hardwick promised to make the tough decisions. If that was getting rid of one of our key players or a marquee forward and suffering a couple of years in the wilderness then so be it. Anyone who thinks that Knights has made any difficult decisions to date is way off the mark. Cole? Campo? Bradley? Bolton? MJ? Ayres? Wallis? Rama? They were the easy ones.

These are the teams that we'll most likely be trying to beat for a flag in three years:

Geelong
Hawthorn
Port Adelaide
Collingwood
Brisbane
West Coast

Have a look at their lists and the age of their key players. Can anyone tell me that our list in three years will be even close to those?

I'm not saying that Knights hasn't done a good job so far, but I definitely think that a premiership by 2010 is extremely bullish.

That can be put down to poor recruiting, which is why we dont have any 'stars' in the age group from 24-27. Pretty hard for knights to be blamed for that when he hasnt been at a draft yet. The reason he is pushing the younger kids through would be so in 3 years time, blokes like Stanton, Watson, Lovett, Winderlich (older i know), monfries, slattery, Ryder etc will be near their prime or at it by that stage.

The first five names there is precisely the reason we are stuffed when Lloyd, Lucas and Fletcher disappear. As you correctly stated, the players highlighted will all be in their prime. Unforunately, they are average to good players at best who will never form the basis of a team capable of winning a flag. We should have traded a couple of them to either a) try and get one gun midfielder aged around 24, or b) get some more good draft picks. We are just wasting time peddling blokes like Stanton, Dyson, Winderlich and Monfries in the midfield.

gringo wrote:The first five names there is precisely the reason we are stuffed when Lloyd, Lucas and Fletcher disappear. As you correctly stated, the players highlighted will all be in their prime. Unforunately, they are average to good players at best who will never form the basis of a team capable of winning a flag. We should have traded a couple of them to either a) try and get one gun midfielder aged around 24, or b) get some more good draft picks. We are just wasting time peddling blokes like Stanton, Dyson, Winderlich and Monfries in the midfield.

I agree with you on Dyson but the rest of those blokes will be fine. You can't lump our current malaise on the kids... You don't expect consistency from your youngsters until they're 22-23. They might not be Judds but they'll be at least A graders when they come into their prime. We just don't have the 23-27 year olds that you need to carry your midfield week in / week out.

If I were the coach coming into this team, I would have targeted 2010-12 rather than 2008-10 and looked to move anyone that wouldn't be around for that period.

andrewb wrote:

gringo wrote:The first five names there is precisely the reason we are stuffed when Lloyd, Lucas and Fletcher disappear. As you correctly stated, the players highlighted will all be in their prime. Unforunately, they are average to good players at best who will never form the basis of a team capable of winning a flag. We should have traded a couple of them to either a) try and get one gun midfielder aged around 24, or b) get some more good draft picks. We are just wasting time peddling blokes like Stanton, Dyson, Winderlich and Monfries in the midfield.

I agree with you on Dyson but the rest of those blokes will be fine. You can't lump our current malaise on the kids... You don't expect consistency from your youngsters until they're 22-23. They might not be Judds but they'll be at least A graders when they come into their prime. We just don't have the 23-27 year olds that you need to carry your midfield week in / week out.

If I were the coach coming into this team, I would have targeted 2010-12 rather than 2008-10 and looked to move anyone that wouldn't be around for that period.

If they arent in the Chris Judd mould then they are just junkity-junk shit.

Take your mind back to 92/93 when we had a bunch of youngsters running around with names such as Hird, Mercuri, Fletcher, Misiti, Calthorpe and Olerenshaw.

I could imagine the same gnashing of teeth back then that we lacked real class through the centre and that we were relying on a bunch of kids to get us through.

I am sure that, apart from James, few would have predicted that most of these guys would end up as legends for the club.

The current batch have all been blooded, some over a couple of seasons. The facination for me will be to see what they can deliver over the next couple of years.

I believe that the pieces are in place apart from our draft picks, and I look forward to next year with more anticipation than for several years.

Gringo, although entitled to your opinion, you are so negative.

Stanton, has been a standout of our young kids, well and truly earned his pay packet and with more time will get even better.

Watson, is a perfect role model for persistence and hard work on his own part to improve his game. Awesome in the clinches, extremely clever and with more time his kicking will not be an issue.

Lovett, I think will relish the change of coach, has shown his skills and speed can be sublime and can be a match winner. More confidence and consistency he could be anything.

Winderlich, has shown he can run his guts out and when he backs himself and makes his opponants play "chasies" when on him is a very creative player.

Monfries, has had limited time in the midfield and when put there in the last three games was in our best each week, was creative, has no respect for his own body..shit he'd run into a herd of sumos if meant he'd get the footy first. Will be an elite player because his attitude and application are sensational.

I don't think any of these kids mean we're stuffed, they've all been around what 3 maybe four for a couple of them and during that time they've been learning their trade in a side that has been down in confidence and getting beaten more often than not.

That's why I'm excited about seeing these boys play under new direction and by someone who only seven years ago was taking the field himself.

They are a sound nucleus of a good team.

andrewb wrote:Knights has been talking about addressing all the easy issues:

1. Modernise the coaching structure.... tick
2. Focus on skills and fitness... tick
3. Play the kids... I hope we'll get a tick here, too.

Should have all been done years ago. Unfortunately, he hasn't addressed the key areas:

1. Hird (1st B/F) retired, Fletcher (2nd B/F), Lucas (3rd B/F), Lloyd all 30+
2. Complete lack of depth in the "prime" age areas of the list.

In three years we will have no Lloyd, Lucas or Fletcher and we can reasonably expect that the three of them will see progressively less time on the field as age takes its toll. As yet, we don't have the real "stars" coming through to replace them.

Hardwick promised to make the tough decisions. If that was getting rid of one of our key players or a marquee forward and suffering a couple of years in the wilderness then so be it. Anyone who thinks that Knights has made any difficult decisions to date is way off the mark. Cole? Campo? Bradley? Bolton? MJ? Ayres? Wallis? Rama? They were the easy ones.

These are the teams that we'll most likely be trying to beat for a flag in three years:

Geelong
Hawthorn
Port Adelaide
Collingwood
Brisbane
West Coast

Have a look at their lists and the age of their key players. Can anyone tell me that our list in three years will be even close to those?

I'm not saying that Knights hasn't done a good job so far, but I definitely think that a premiership by 2010 is extremely bullish.

In three years a lot can happen, I'd suggest WC are on a bit of a slide, Port might have some good youngsters coming through, but they will lose some good experience..(cornes/burgoynes all prob on their way, ditto tredea)

I would pencil in the hawks/cats and maybe brisbane as being still very strong teams. but the others def up for debate.

the pies are going to suffer without clement, rocca won't be around for much longer etc.

I'd argue that our club could be anywhere in 3 years time. We have got plenty of good strong KPP players coming through, we just need to hit the jackpot with a couple of them.

I'm also enthusiastic about our midfield. I think our boys will be peaking when most of the top teams mids are starting to decline.(maybe the exception is geelong)

this is through red and black tinted glasses I know...but I think a lot of the other clubs mentioned would have similar worries to us.

We have one HUGE hole to fix in the next 2 years, and that is replacing Dustin Fletcher.

Hush little Filthy dont say a word,
Twits is gona buy you a mockingbird
And if that mockingbird dont sing
Then dont worry old mate cos at least you'll have the 2008 wooden spoon to celebrate.
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Twits wrote:Hush little Filthy dont say a word,
Twits is gona buy you a mockingbird
And if that mockingbird dont sing
Then dont worry old mate cos at least you'll have the 2008 wooden spoon to celebrate.
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Man... The collective IQ of the BT website just bombed bigtime...