Jazz_84 wrote:I've never seen back peddling like this before.... WOW
Neil Cordy wrote:
AFL chief Andrew Demetriou backs James Hird's handling of Essendon drug investigation
AFL CEO Andrew Demetriou says James Hird is innocent until proven guilty. Picture: Tony Gough Herald Sun
AFL boss Andrew Demetriou has refuted reports he called for James Hird to step aside from his position as coach of Essendon while the ASADA investigation continued.
Speaking at a sponsors lunch for the GWS Giants in Sydney today, Demetriou declared Hird is doing the right thing by not commenting about his conduct in the media.
"What I said was James Hird when he was going through his thought process I'm sure that (stepping aside from his coaching job) is one of the things he's considering, that's exactly what I said,'' Demetriou said.
"I didn't call for him to stand down at all.
"I don't think he should at all put it (his case) in the public forum, he's absolutely doing the most appropriate that he's responding to the investigation in accordance with the process of the investigation."
Demetriou also said Hird and the Essendon Football Club are entitled to be viewed as innocent until proven guilty.
"He's entitled to go through that process,'' Demetriou said.
"I don't get it when a media outlet says when they put 17 questions and he refuses to answer them why they think he should answer those questions from the media.
"They're not investigating him, he's being investigated by ASADA.
"He is entitled as an individual to the presumption of innocence, something we should all hold very sacred in this country.
While the Essendon coach may be suffering badly in the court of public opinion, the AFL CEO said it had no bearing on the ASADA investigation.
"I don't think the court of public opinion matters at all in this instance because it's a serious issue,'' Demetriou said.
"He's being investigated as part of the Essendon Football Club and he, like several other people and the players included, will be interviewed by ASADA and they may be interviewed again.
"But we have to let that process run it's course so we are all better informed.
"I am no more informed about the progress, I haven't even had a briefing about what happened in his interview the other day.
"ASADA are leading the investigation it'll take time I know people want it done expeditiously, but these things do take time."
f***'n Tosser!!
He knows exactly what he was implying.
I wonder what has changed???
Too far for Baker now he's on to it, now he’s got it, OPEN GOAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Dons are in front by one point at the 8 minute mark
nothing because "he hasn't been briefed on the ASADA interview" pleeeeeease
Kakadu Kangaroos
Captain of the first BomberTalk International Test Squad
BT Soccer World Cup Champion Captain of the Bombertalk Reds 3rd with 4 wins - 108.30%
(6 games) - 65 kicks, 33 marks, 52 handballs, 4 tackles, 3 Hit Outs, 2 goals
What little credibility Demetriou had just went up in smoke. Jim must have a wry grin on his face after reading is Vlad's latest duck for cover.
A week ago this idiot was spouting off about how he knew more details than the general public and today he is claiming he is no more wise to the facts than anyone else.
boncer34 wrote:Demons now in the shit to. Cept they didn't come out and admit it.
Interesting as I was expecting it to be Dank's word against Hird's if it came down to it and we would assume Hird's integrity would win the day - so if it's just Dank's word against Melbourne - who we must assume will refute the claims - does that strengthen or weaken Hird's defense?
boncer34 wrote:Demons now in the shit to. Cept they didn't come out and admit it.
Interesting as I was expecting it to be Dank's word against Hird's if it came down to it and we would assume Hird's integrity would win the day - so if it's just Dank's word against Melbourne - who we must assume will refute the claims - does that strengthen or weaken Hird's defense?
Interestingly - I have heard (from some relatively creditable source) that because Dank will not be interviewed by ASADA - this actually makes it harder for Hird as it isnt one person's word against the other ... but Hirdy having to establish his innocence against allegations in the public domain.
Kafkaesque and more the sort of thing that you would expect in 1984!
I don't think it either strengthens nor weakens Hird's defence. I think what it does it shows that Dank was a loose cannon to some extent in and around the AFL. Vlad would be kicking himself because he didn't do something about the situation when it was first raised last year. Melbourne have made the point that Dank was not employed by them at all but someone within their club was operating through him and don't forget he must have been being paid. BY WHO?
"The detailed texts show Dank suggested Melbourne players be injected with PRP, a substance used to treat sporting injuries that was taken off the World Anti-Doping Agency's banned list only in 2011."
"The detailed texts show Dank suggested Melbourne players be injected with PRP, a substance used to treat sporting injuries that was taken off the World Anti-Doping Agency's banned list only in 2011."
What a farce. No one is sure what's banned and what's not, what's "pushing the envelope", and what is clearly acceptable. What is a valid method for one substance is illegal for another. 6 types of one substance (peptide hgh) is banned and a 7th is not. What's banned one year might not be the next. What's banned in some sports isn't in others (e.g. Some anabolic steroids in baseball).
Perhaps the argument ( that I've always opposed) that anyone can take whatever they want might be the best way to get rid of a mob of meaningless "investigators" and bureacrats who suddenly seek to impose their moral authority even when their own rules permit individuals or organizations to work within those rules (yes you Vlad).
I'm very confused as to why Dank doesn't have to talk to ASADA.... he is the biggest key man in this investigation, I know he isn't employed by anyone currently so he is lucky there but surely the courts can force him? Him talking through the media releasing info week by week is a complete joke and making this a circus
Kakadu Kangaroos
Captain of the first BomberTalk International Test Squad
BT Soccer World Cup Champion Captain of the Bombertalk Reds 3rd with 4 wins - 108.30%
(6 games) - 65 kicks, 33 marks, 52 handballs, 4 tackles, 3 Hit Outs, 2 goals
Jazz_84 wrote:I'm very confused as to why Dank doesn't have to talk to ASADA.... he is the biggest key man in this investigation, I know he isn't employed by anyone currently so he is lucky there but surely the courts can force him? Him talking through the media releasing info week by week is a complete joke and making this a circus
I guess at the end of the day, no civil law has been broken. Anti-Doping and the enforcement of associated rules is a self regulatory issue set up by world sporting bodies. As such, there is no "law" that compels Dank to testify. This is also the reason why the media is free to comment on the issues - "subjudicay" does not apply but defamation laws could come into the picture.
I have listened to Vlad's comments a number times. He was never very strong about Hird standing down but said what he said in terms a suggestion and intimation that Hird must be under going a lot of pressure. So when he says its the way what he said was reported that has caused the problem I tend to agree. Caro took Andrew's words and beat them like a Salvation Army drum all last Friday and into the weekend. When she found she had lost the PR battle and Hird was in a position of strength she has slowly slowly relented.
She has come out this a complete fool. I expect her to scream for all and sundry at Melbourne to resign however her hysterical ravings seem to be only restricted to out club.
Jazz_84 wrote:I'm very confused as to why Dank doesn't have to talk to ASADA.... he is the biggest key man in this investigation, I know he isn't employed by anyone currently so he is lucky there but surely the courts can force him? Him talking through the media releasing info week by week is a complete joke and making this a circus
I am assuming that it is Dank feeding these text messages to the media. If so, you question what is in it for him.
Any clues???
Too far for Baker now he's on to it, now he’s got it, OPEN GOAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Dons are in front by one point at the 8 minute mark
Demons doctor given the arse according to the messages on the bottom of the screen on the game tonight. WTF? Talk about scapegoating after 1 full day of media scrutiny.....
I just cannot believe the lack of fuss about the Melbourne revelations.
Given that there has (so far) been no evidence produced of any wrong-doing at EFC, and it's all just rumour and innuendo, then someone please explain why pretty much the same situation at Melbourne has barely raised a whimper.
Even the first report I read about it the other night went to pains to say the alleged substances weren't illegal anyway - despite several of them being the same substances alleged to have been used at EFC.
Also noted that when they've referred to the EFC case they've described the substances using inflammatory words like "tree bark" and "cows first milk" but the Melbourne article simply called them (sorry, can't exactly remember) by normal names.
Given the inferences of what's been said so far, I cannot understand the lack of media attention to the Dees (except the cynic in me says the media can't be bothered because Melbourne are down and out anyway, whereas they stand to "claim a big scalp" by dragging EFC down).
nudder12 wrote:(except the cynic in me says the media can't be bothered because Melbourne are down and out anyway, whereas they stand to "claim a big scalp" by dragging EFC down).
I think that's exactly it!
Or the media know they went too hard to begin with..... but I'm going for your reason
Kakadu Kangaroos
Captain of the first BomberTalk International Test Squad
BT Soccer World Cup Champion Captain of the Bombertalk Reds 3rd with 4 wins - 108.30%
(6 games) - 65 kicks, 33 marks, 52 handballs, 4 tackles, 3 Hit Outs, 2 goals
John Silvester wrote:
A controversial sports biochemist says an organised crime network wanted him to spike AFL players' supplements with illicit drugs as part of a plan to blackmail them into joining a match-fixing ring.
READ: A peep behind the sporting curtain
Shane Charter, a central figure in the Essendon drug investigation, has decided to ignore legal advice and speak publicly after he was threatened, bashed, had his home burgled and a family pet killed since his name was linked to the supplement program. ''I just wanted to disappear and keep my head down but after what has happened I think my best defence is to shout out from the rooftops,'' he said.
In a series of interviews with Fairfax Media, he claims he:
■Provided the head of the Essendon supplement program, Stephen Dank, with ASADA-banned peptides sourced from China.
■Has seen blood test results that showed AFL players (not linked to the Essendon program) took banned performance-enhancing products.
■Used independent laboratory drug analyses to warn Australian Olympic athletes to pull out of events because they would fail competition-day tests.
''The ACC (Australian Crime Commission report on crime links to sport) is right but they have just scratched the surface,'' he said.
Charter said he was prepared to give evidence to the ASADA inquiry.
''If I want to be part of the solution then I should co-operate with them.''
He said he was asked to provide footballers' confidential blood results to professional punters wanting ''inside information'' on players' match readiness.
Charter said gangsters asked him to spike players' supplements with cocaine so the blood tests he ordered could be used as a blackmail tool. ''They also wanted inside information from our data to see which players would play well.''
He said he refused to co-operate.
Charter also revealed he heard Essendon coach James Hird tell Dank he must protect the health of his players, adhere to drug regulations and liaise with club doctor Bruce Reid.
Charter, who worked with Hird in 2003 as a strength and nutrition adviser, said the present-day coach was a stickler for remaining within the rules. ''Whenever I gave him a supplement he would ring the doctor and read the label to him to make sure it didn't contain any banned substances.
''He is an intelligent man and I doubt he would be a voluntary party to player doping,'' he said.
Charter said he heard Dank claim at a December 2011 pre-season Essendon training camp held in Queensland that he suspected another AFL club was using human growth hormones. He also witnessed Hird tell the sports scientist he wanted his club to remain within the rules.
Charter said Hird laid down three conditions to any program - ''that there were no long-term dangers to players' health; that it was all WADA-compliant; and that everything had to be run past the club doctor. He was adamant.''
Charter, a former world-class powerlifter, admits to using steroids and human growth hormones when he competed internationally.
''I used every performance-enhancing drug I was considering recommending to athletes so that I would personally know the physical and psychological effects.''
As a result he had a heart attack at the age of 32, with surgeons saying he was lucky to survive. He was arrested in 2004 over the importation of 100,000 Malaysian pseudoephedrine tablets, used to make amphetamines. He pleaded guilty and was sentenced to four years with a minimum of two.
He said he had been part of a group importing steroids to be sold in the gym black market and then ''stupidly'' moved into the amphetamines market. ''I learnt my lesson and have kept my nose clean ever since.''
The biochemist, who also uses the marketing name, ''Dr Ageless'', said he provided Dank with Chinese peptides, including human growth stimulators such as Hexarelin, CJC 1295 and Thymosin Beta 4, plus at least four other muscle-building and training recovery products popular with bodybuilders. He also said he provided vitamin B and C supplements.
When Dank worked at NRL club Cronulla in 2011, some players were given supplements, including the human growth stimulant CJC1295, which has since been banned by WADA. The sports scientist said he did nothing illegal while working for the club. Charter has an email from an independent expert warning that if the Chinese peptides were given to AFL players it would breach all sports drug regulations and would be ''horribly wrong''. Charter said the peptides were not sent directly to Dank but delivered to South Yarra compounding chemist Nima Alavi, who spent $50,000 to build a sterile unit where supplements could be prepared. ''Dank would order a batch and pick them up personally,'' he said.
ASADA is investigating whether any of the controversial peptides provided by Charter were used in the Essendon supplement program.
Dank has consistently denied injecting Essendon players with banned substances and maintains he has always worked within sports' drug regulations. Fairfax Media has seen no evidence to contradict the claims.
Charter said he stopped supplying Dank with peptides in late April 2012 after the sports scientist missed payment deadlines.
Kakadu Kangaroos
Captain of the first BomberTalk International Test Squad
BT Soccer World Cup Champion Captain of the Bombertalk Reds 3rd with 4 wins - 108.30%
(6 games) - 65 kicks, 33 marks, 52 handballs, 4 tackles, 3 Hit Outs, 2 goals
pleeeeeease
