Clanger Hangar 2019

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Crazyman
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by Crazyman » Mon Apr 08, 2019 12:40 am

I think there’s a difference between clangers and damaging.

He may not have had a lot of clangers, but by the same token, his disposals have (in large part) not ‘damaged’ the opposition...

You don’t always need loads of possessions to influence a game...
Last edited by Crazyman on Mon Apr 08, 2019 2:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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s'dreams
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by s'dreams » Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:31 am

Crazyman wrote:
Mon Apr 08, 2019 12:40 am
You don’t always need loads of possessions to influence a game...
Yep - I've always said this about umpires. Zero possessions, sometimes lots of influence. :lol:
dices ad adepto futui (tell them to f*** off)

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by Crazyman » Mon Apr 08, 2019 2:22 pm

s'dreams wrote:
Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:31 am
Crazyman wrote:
Mon Apr 08, 2019 12:40 am
You don’t always need loads of possessions to influence a game...
Yep - I've always said this about umpires. Zero possessions, sometimes lots of influence. :lol:
Touché 👍😂

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BenDoolan
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by BenDoolan » Sun Apr 14, 2019 10:33 pm

R1 = 52 clangers from 308 disposals (GWS 41 from 371 disposals)
R2 = 61 clangers from 361 disposals (St.K 64 from 348 disposals)
R3 = 52 clangers from 369 disposals (Melb 55 clangers from 352 disposals)
R4 = 64 clangers from 407 disposals (Bris 52 clangers from 377 disposals)

Tom Bellchambers 16 clangers from 33 disposals
Dyson Heppell 14 clangers from 97 disposals
Matt Guelfi 13 clangers from 36 disposals
Adam Saad 13 clangers from 65 disposals
Devon Smith 13 clangers from 76 disposals
Dylan Shiel 12 clangers from 111 disposals
Andrew McGrath 11 clangers from 85 disposals
David Zaharakis 11 clangers from 104 disposals
Mark Baguley 10 clangers from 35 disposals
Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti 10 clangers from 46 disposals
Jake Stringer 10 clangers from 49 disposals

Clangers ranking: 13th
Disposals ranking: 13th
Disposals Efficiency = 71.7% (ranked 11th in the league)
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Windy_Hill
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by Windy_Hill » Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:47 am

Clangers in general have little bearing on results.

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by Crazyman » Mon Apr 15, 2019 8:06 am

Windy_Hill wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:47 am
Clangers in general have little bearing on results.
Unless we have a kick in from a behind and we are up by less than a goal...then it’s almost guaranteed we lose...

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by BenDoolan » Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:16 am

Windy_Hill wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:47 am
Clangers in general have little bearing on results.
They can have a lot of bearing on results. Clangers cause turnovers and a lot result in scores against. It just so happens that the opposition also produces clangers and the same applies to them. It comes down to how good you can capitalise on those turnovers/ missed opportunities.
Unfortunately, you can't drown a witch!

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by Rover99 » Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:12 pm

Windy_Hill wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:47 am
Clangers in general have little bearing on results.
Yes, if the other team has more clangers than you do :D

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by grassy1 » Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:52 pm

Except Brisbane had less Clangers than us and still lose by 8 goals.

I took an occasional glance at some Premier League Stats.

A team can amass 600 passes over 90 or so minutes(plus injury time)and either put the ballin the onion bag 3 times or none.

There may have been a passing efficiency percentage,but I wouldn’t mind seeing a missed passes column,to see how human the pros,paid multi - million pounds are. 8)

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by Windy_Hill » Fri Apr 19, 2019 11:06 pm

BenDoolan wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:16 am
Windy_Hill wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:47 am
Clangers in general have little bearing on results.
They can have a lot of bearing on results. Clangers cause turnovers and a lot result in scores against. It just so happens that the opposition also produces clangers and the same applies to them. It comes down to how good you can capitalise on those turnovers/ missed opportunities.
Here are the Top 20 Clanger Culprits from 2018:

Basically, the game's superstars - as I keep saying - Clangers mean nothing when looked at in isolation (Note first number =Games, second number = clangers)

1 Elliot Yeo West Coast 25 120
2 Taylor Adams Collingwood 23 110
3 Dustin Martin Richmond 3 107
4 Tom Mitchell Hawthorn 24 100
5 Clayton Oliver Melbourne 25 99
5 Patrick Cripps Carlton 22 99
7 Toby Nankervis Richmond 23 95
7 Joel Selwood Geelong 23 95
7 Ben Cunnington North Melbourne 22 95
10 Dayne Zorko Brisbane 22 92
10 Heath Shaw GWS 20 92
12 Brodie Grundy Collingwood 26 91
12 Steele Sidebottom Collingwood 26 91
12 Patrick Dangerfield Geelong 22 91
15 Stephen Coniglio GWS 23 90
15 Tim Kelly Geelong 23 90
17 Angus Brayshaw Melbourne 22 89
18 Christian Petracca Melbourne 24 88
19 Luke Parker Sydney 22 87
20 Dylan Shiel

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BenDoolan
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by BenDoolan » Fri Apr 19, 2019 11:20 pm

Windy_Hill wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 11:06 pm
BenDoolan wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:16 am
Windy_Hill wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:47 am
Clangers in general have little bearing on results.
They can have a lot of bearing on results. Clangers cause turnovers and a lot result in scores against. It just so happens that the opposition also produces clangers and the same applies to them. It comes down to how good you can capitalise on those turnovers/ missed opportunities.
Here are the Top 20 Clanger Culprits from 2018:

Basically, the game's superstars - as I keep saying - Clangers mean nothing when looked at in isolation (Note first number =Games, second number = clangers)

1 Elliot Yeo West Coast 25 120
2 Taylor Adams Collingwood 23 110
3 Dustin Martin Richmond 3 107
4 Tom Mitchell Hawthorn 24 100
5 Clayton Oliver Melbourne 25 99
5 Patrick Cripps Carlton 22 99
7 Toby Nankervis Richmond 23 95
7 Joel Selwood Geelong 23 95
7 Ben Cunnington North Melbourne 22 95
10 Dayne Zorko Brisbane 22 92
10 Heath Shaw GWS 20 92
12 Brodie Grundy Collingwood 26 91
12 Steele Sidebottom Collingwood 26 91
12 Patrick Dangerfield Geelong 22 91
15 Stephen Coniglio GWS 23 90
15 Tim Kelly Geelong 23 90
17 Angus Brayshaw Melbourne 22 89
18 Christian Petracca Melbourne 24 88
19 Luke Parker Sydney 22 87
20 Dylan Shiel
You’re the one looking at them in isolation.

What were all their disposal numbers and efficiencies?
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BenDoolan
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by BenDoolan » Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:25 am

R1 = 52 clangers from 308 disposals (GWS 41 from 371 disposals)
R2 = 61 clangers from 361 disposals (St.K 64 from 348 disposals)
R3 = 52 clangers from 369 disposals (Melb 55 clangers from 352 disposals)
R4 = 64 clangers from 407 disposals (Bris 52 clangers from 377 disposals)
R5 = 62 clangers from 407 disposals (NM 52 clangers from 378 disposals)

Tom Bellchambers 18 clangers from 46 disposals (DE: 71.7%)
Dyson Heppell 17 clangers from 129 disposals (DE: 72.9%)
Dylan Shiel 17 clangers from 147 disposals (DE: 67.3%)
Mark Baguley 16 clangers from 45 disposals (DE: 80.0%)
Matt Guelfi 16 clangers from 57 disposals (DE: 64.9%)
Adam Saad 14 clangers from 83 disposals (DE: 84.3%)
Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti 13 clangers from 57 disposals (DE: 73.7%)
Devon Smith 13 clangers from 76 disposals (DE: 57.9%)
Michael Hurley 13 clangers from 103 disposals (DE: 77.7%)
David Myers 12 clangers from 78 disposals (DE: 61.8%)
Orazio Fantasia 12 clangers from 85 disposals (DE: 70.7%)
Zach Merrett 12 clangers from 144 disposals (DE: 80.6%)

Clangers ranking: 13th (To be updated)
Disposals ranking: 13th (To be updated)
Disposals Efficiency = 71.7% (ranked 11th in the league) (To be updated)
Unfortunately, you can't drown a witch!

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Windy_Hill
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by Windy_Hill » Mon Apr 22, 2019 8:16 am

BenDoolan wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 11:20 pm
Windy_Hill wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 11:06 pm
BenDoolan wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:16 am
Windy_Hill wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:47 am
Clangers in general have little bearing on results.
They can have a lot of bearing on results. Clangers cause turnovers and a lot result in scores against. It just so happens that the opposition also produces clangers and the same applies to them. It comes down to how good you can capitalise on those turnovers/ missed opportunities.
Here are the Top 20 Clanger Culprits from 2018:

Basically, the game's superstars - as I keep saying - Clangers mean nothing when looked at in isolation (Note first number =Games, second number = clangers)

1 Elliot Yeo West Coast 25 120
2 Taylor Adams Collingwood 23 110
3 Dustin Martin Richmond 3 107
4 Tom Mitchell Hawthorn 24 100
5 Clayton Oliver Melbourne 25 99
5 Patrick Cripps Carlton 22 99
7 Toby Nankervis Richmond 23 95
7 Joel Selwood Geelong 23 95
7 Ben Cunnington North Melbourne 22 95
10 Dayne Zorko Brisbane 22 92
10 Heath Shaw GWS 20 92
12 Brodie Grundy Collingwood 26 91
12 Steele Sidebottom Collingwood 26 91
12 Patrick Dangerfield Geelong 22 91
15 Stephen Coniglio GWS 23 90
15 Tim Kelly Geelong 23 90
17 Angus Brayshaw Melbourne 22 89
18 Christian Petracca Melbourne 24 88
19 Luke Parker Sydney 22 87
20 Dylan Shiel
You’re the one looking at them in isolation.

What were all their disposal numbers and efficiencies?
Dunno, but I would assume the higher the disposal numbers, the higher the total number of clangers. So looking at clangers alone doesn’t really mean the player/team is performing badly. All I am trying to say is that the best players will have the highest number of clangers. So disposal efficiency is probably the better statistic.

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by Crazyman » Mon Apr 22, 2019 9:23 am

The majority on that list spend time in around clearances (Shaw the obvious exception).

As such most of their clangers will be under pressure.

What stands out with our clangers is how bad they are. Missing targets by hand and foot under no pressure. Missing shots on goal from inside 30 at no more than 45 degree angles, kickin turn overs resulting in goals...the general obvious shitness of our clangers is what stands out...

Dusty, Danger & co. Generally have clangers getting the ball out of a pack...we have that, but sooooo many more horrid ones.

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BenDoolan
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by BenDoolan » Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:03 am

Just so we know what this is all about...

Clanger: a blatant, unforced error. This can be conceding a free kick (OOF, deliberate rushed etc) or kicking or handpassing the ball directly to an opponent or dropping an uncontested mark.

We saw a good example of one where it cost a direct goal when Ridley missed his target (Redman) and gifted Ben Brown his first goal.

Other rotten examples are Joe Daniher missing from point blank range (last year) and then the opposition kicking in and travelling the length of the ground for a goal themselves. They are killers.

Naturally, the opposition has clangers too. And sometimes we benefit from them with goals ourselves. Initially (last year), I was trying to highlight all our clangers that cost goals. It got too difficult because their were too many to try and remember.

As for the best players having the highest Clanger numbers...they are most likely the highest possession winners. Not to mention, they are the most damaging players for their respective teams. So you don’t mind if Paddy Dangerfield has 91 clangers from 619 disposals, 108 clearances, 24 goals, and 23 goal assists. But you might ask a question from a David Myers with 55 clangers from 329 disposals, 79 clearances, 10 goals, and 10 goal assists. Hmmm let’s see...Myers pick 6 in 2007 draft, Dangerfield pick 10. Nice.

Anyway, I hope you get my drift.
Unfortunately, you can't drown a witch!

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by grassy1 » Mon Apr 22, 2019 12:24 pm

So long as Dangerfield didn’t Bugger off to another Club,with some excuse or another,

Granted,he left Adelaide to do it.But could we be sure,he wouldn’t have buggered off about 2012 onwards?

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by BenDoolan » Mon Apr 22, 2019 12:34 pm

grassy1 wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 12:24 pm
So long as Dangerfield didn’t Bugger off to another Club,with some excuse or another,

Granted,he left Adelaide to do it.But could we be sure,he wouldn’t have buggered off about 2012 onwards?
Being in Victoria might have kept him at the club. But then again, he might have been embroiled with the drug saga and pissed off. Hard to say. But if he did, we would have got something decent for him.
Unfortunately, you can't drown a witch!

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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by MH_Bomber » Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:23 pm

Clangers smangers!

Watching other games over the weekend and over the last few weeks we are definitely not being affected adversely by clangers.

What I have noticed that our numbers in and under and then on the outside have minimised the impact of clangers. Our pressure has caused many clangers from our opposition.

From a way we going about point of view, we are playing the brand that suits the team we have. We would love to minimise clangers but the game style now seems to mitigate their effect.

Out best weapons are effective tackling causing relentless pressure followed by speed of movement in counterattack . We commit most clangers when attempting to play tempo football for too long.
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by MH_Bomber » Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:23 pm

Clangers smangers!

Watching other games over the weekend and over the last few weeks we are definitely not being affected adversely by clangers.

What I have noticed that our numbers in and under and then on the outside have minimised the impact of clangers. Our pressure has caused many clangers from our opposition.

From a way we going about point of view, we are playing the brand that suits the team we have. We would love to minimise clangers but the game style now seems to mitigate their effect.

Out best weapons are effective tackling causing relentless pressure followed by speed of movement in counterattack . We commit most clangers when attempting to play tempo football for too long.
Regards

MH_Bomber

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BenDoolan
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Re: Clanger Hangar 2019

Post by BenDoolan » Mon Apr 22, 2019 2:01 pm

MH_Bomber wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:23 pm
Clangers smangers!

Watching other games over the weekend and over the last few weeks we are definitely not being affected adversely by clangers.
Depends if you have your definition of Clanger right
What I have noticed that our numbers in and under and then on the outside have minimised the impact of clangers. Our pressure has caused many clangers from our opposition.
Sorry to make an example of your comment (I’m not having a direct go at you), but others are making the mistake of thinking turnovers caused by pressure = Clanger. It’s not. Clangers are unforced errors. Again, Clangers are unforced errors. A miskick caused by a tackle is not a Clanger. A dropped marked caused by a marking contest, is not a Clanger. A missed goal from point blank range, caused by a bump, is not a Clanger. And so on...
We commit most clangers when attempting to play tempo football for too long.
This is true. When we are trying to control possession, we end up losing possession through a dumb error (CLANGER) that ends up in the opposition hands and ultimately, a goal. How many times have we tried to chip, chip, chip our kicks in the D50 and someone shanks a kick (CLANGER) that gifts a goal?
Unfortunately, you can't drown a witch!

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